I had kind of gotten this rhythm as a running back, and I just kind of had my head down with blinders on every season. Just my goal was a thousand yards every season. Next thing I know, I look up and they're handing me a ball after the Rams game in my eleventh year and they're saying, hey, you just went over ten thousand yards. I had no idea that I was even that close. I had even I didn't even have any idea that that was a milestone. So when they told me and, you know, they gave me the ball, it didn't hit me until after the game. Um, when I started getting phone calls from my old teammates like Brian Urlacher and some of these guys, and they would call me and say, hey, man, that's a great accomplishment. And I'm like, it is like I had just, you know, had reset my whole entire agenda. As in, the NFL is just being the thousand yard rusher every season and competing that I didn't even realize that I had come up on that milestone. So I think that, for me, was the best way for me to, uh, to enter the ten thousand dollars club is I didn't even realize I was in it. Welcome to Self Equity, the podcast that dives into the inspiring journeys of founders, entrepreneurs, athletes and entertainers. I'm your host Jolene Tepedino, authorised officer and team business manager for the Zelniker Dorfman Car and Heritage Group at UBS. Today, on episode twenty five of Self Equity, we're joined by Thomas Jones, former Pro Bowl running back and the heartbeat of the New York Jets offense. After rushing for over ten thousand yards in the NFL, Thomas reinvented himself as an actor, producer and entrepreneur. We talk about the business side of football, the mindset that fueled his success, and how he's built equity well beyond the game. Joining me on today's episode is Ryan Lynch, financial advisor for the Zelniker Dorfman Car and Heritage Group.
TJ, great to see you. Thank you for joining us Self Equity podcast today. Thank you so much for having me. Really excited to to have this conversation. So TJ growing up in a coal mining town in Virginia, your parents instilled a strong work ethic in you and your siblings. How did that upbringing shape your approach to life and what role did your family play in your success? Man, that's a great question. Grew up in a very, very small town in Virginia. Population, I think at the time may have been forty three hundred. Now I think it might be two thousand five hundred. It's a small town called big Stone gap in the far southwest corner of the state of Virginia. Uh, the biggest industry was coal mining. Most people in the state of Virginia don't even know we're there. We're kind of just tucked away because, you know, when you go to Virginia, usually you'll go to Hampton or Virginia Beach or you'll go to Central Virginia, Richmond, that area or Northern Virginia. You know, Arlington, Alexandria, and as far west as usually people come would be maybe Roanoke, Virginia. Uh, so we're three hours further south west of Roanoke. So we're kind of like in the corner there. And the biggest industry there was coal mining. And my mother actually worked nineteen years underground as a coal miner. Um, my father worked one year underground, and he was laid off, and he worked to get back in the coal mines, because in that at that time, there was pretty good money. Uh, but unfortunately, he wasn't able to, uh, to be rehired. So my mother worked nineteen years. My father worked one year. And honestly, that's how I ended up selecting my football number in the NFL or which was number twenty for the combined number of years. Uh, they worked in the coal mines as inspiration. So growing up in that part of Virginia, very secluded. But the good thing about it is, you know, it's a very, very community based place. Uh, I learned a lot of just really, really good skills, um, that I think I've been able to utilize throughout my journey.
You know, just being, um, a hard worker, obviously, watching my mom and dad work in the coal mines, you know, that's just something that just comes natural for me is work ethic and and being dedicated, dedicated to a cause, you know, in our area, um, there's, there's not a lot of real major obstacles, but the coal miners there stick together. That's what I saw my mom and my dad do and the people in my area. So I was always taught to fight for what you believe in and be dedicated. And also, you know, as as a team player, um, you know, so it was a great place to grow up just from a moral perspective and work ethic perspective. And I think those things that I learned have really helped me on my journey. So speaking of family, you and your brother, uh, you know, also, you both play college football, big time football. You play in the NFL together. What was it like going through high school together, growing up and then ending up in the at the highest level that you could possibly achieve and and go to the NFL. Man, it was a great experience. Um, he's a big football fan. He played football in high school. I had four or five uncles that played. So I come from a sports family, a football family. One of my uncles was a really, really legendary football player in that area. His name was Ed Clark and his nickname was The Stoney Stallion because of the town that he grew up in, which was called Stonega, Virginia. Yeah, he was legendary.
Legendary, uh, fullback back in the in the sixties almost was kind of our destiny, I guess, of sorts for football. Uh, all of my cousins played, you know, um, obviously me and my brother, we played, you know, pop from Pop Warner all the way up to high school. But, you know, my dad took us to the University of Tennessee football games a lot because they were closer to us in proximity than any other major college. There were about an hour and forty five minutes away from my hometown in Knoxville, Tennessee. And so huge football program there, huge stadium, over one hundred thousand thousand at eight nine years old. I'm in Neyland Stadium watching those games, um, and watching those teams in the late nineties, late eighties and early 90s and being inspired. Um, and so my brother and I, we always dreamed of playing football, uh, at the highest level. And, um, and we were introduced to it at a young level. You know, I think everything just kind of like, transpired kind of accordingly. You know, we I was three years older than him, so I was getting ready to graduate high school, and he was just a freshman. Um, you know, so we had that three year age gap. But it was great because I think I always was motivated by him to be an example for him. And I think he was motivated by me to kind of, uh, carry the torch. Um, and so it worked perfectly all the way into the, into the NFL. So it was a great experience. You know, you go to college, great collegiate career. You come out, go into the NFL, you're not only a first round draft pick, but a top ten pick. We work with a lot of baseball players and they talk about the minor leagues being a long grind, right? And you have to earn your way up each level. The NFL. You're going right from college to the major leagues right away. What's that jump like and how significant of a change was it for you? Your first year or two? I mean, it was, you know, you're going from literally boys to men immediately, you know, in high school and college, you're playing because you love the game. And even in college, if you like, aspire to make it to the NFL. I mean, the odds of you making it are very like, small. So there's a part of the pageantry of high school football and pageantry and college football that adds to the allure of it and and then adds to the motivation for you to go out there and play. But once you're in the NFL, you're now an employee of that billion dollar company.
And when you've been playing football for free your whole life and for the love of the game, and then immediately within a, you know, from the draft in April to August or July training camp, you go from just an amateur to a professional. It's a huge jump in a couple of months, and a lot of guys don't have that. The mindset of a professional yet, because, you know, we're just graduating from college, just moved out of our dorms, you know, into a new place. And wherever we were drafted. And that was me. I was drafted by the Arizona Cardinals, the seventh pick, and I was thankful and happy to be drafted. Obviously, my dream had come true, but at the time, Arizona wasn't really that good of a team, and the organization was known to be a little more on the cheap side. And so it wasn't the best possible scenario. Um, so it was difficult for me for the first year because I was like, whoa. I went from being like this highly rated college kid to this guy that was ranked the seventh overall, that was given a lot of money. And now I'm expected to take this three and thirteen team to the Super Bowl. So it was a lot of pressure. I had to really adjust in regards to the structure of football. Um, the fact that this is my job now, it's I don't have class anymore. You know, this is all I'm doing all day. It's football. It's going to practice. It's going to train to the train. It's going in the weight room. It's watching film. It's going home, around, around the clock. Um, and also on the business side, you know, you you you I really didn't understand what an employee was because I had never had a real job. Because in college, during those times, we, you know, there was no nil and we couldn't have a job, um, you know, against the NCAA rules. So I didn't have a job. This was my first real job. And, um, I was used to playing football for free as opposed to being an employee. And so I had to adjust to that schedule and, um, and some of the nuances that come with that. So my rookie year was a pretty tough transition, also being three hours behind, you know, on the, on the, on the, uh, Pacific time and of all I've known is all I've known is Virginia and green grass and mountains. And then you're in Arizona now it's one hundred and twenty degrees and everything is brown and there's cactus in your backyard. There was a lot that I had had to adjust to. Yeah, I think that's one thing that gets talked about a lot with quarterbacks, at least in today's current NFL like fit in scheme and and how, you know, you go to a bad situation a talented kid could play. It's really anybody.
Right. It's a whole change in your life from top to bottom. You know, you talk about going to Arizona and when we work with business owners, a lot of times they say, you know, getting the business off the ground is the hardest thing. A lot of businesses fail in the first few years because you don't have a real plan. So your first year or two, like you said, rough spot, rough start. And then as your career gets going, you find yourself in a better situation when you finally end up at Chicago. How did you kind of maintain your professionalism and find the place that was really right for you at your career flourish? Well, I mean, you made a good point. It's you don't have a plan, which is why you fail the first couple of years. And I didn't have a plan. Um, you know, my my goal and my dream was to make it to the NFL. Once I made it, I didn't have a goal or a dream or a plan. So I was kind of just there and trying to figure it out as I went. And that didn't work. So I had to take the time to assess what I could do better, what I was doing wrong, the obstacles that I was up against, and figure out how to one by one work around those. Part of it was understanding that this is my job now. It's not football as I've known it my whole life. This is a job. I'm being paid to do this. I'm not playing because I just love the game. And I love the cool, the cleats look or my shoulder pads, you know, have a back flap on them or all the things as a kid that you like. It's like, no, you're getting paid real money to work for this company and to be productive to make them their money back. You're a product now. And so I had to learn that at an early age. Luckily, I was able to because it took a lot of kind of the personal feelings that you may have towards your job away and made it just business. So I understood how to become a businessman pretty early, based off of my rough experiences in in Arizona. Then I was able to be traded to Chicago, moved to Tampa initially and play there for a year and then create a plan for my career. Hey, what do I want to do? I want to be a Pro Bowler. I want to be an All-Pro. I want to play in the Super Bowl. Um, you know, I want to be recognized as one of the best backs to ever play. I want to rush for ten thousand yards. All these different things, all these different goals. Uh, I was able to set for myself. So my first couple of years were like a typical entrepreneur, new business owner.
You know, I failed my first few years because I didn't have a plan. But what I did was I was humble enough, uh, and accountable enough to circle back and say, hey, okay, sure, this team isn't that good. And they haven't been good ever, for the most part. But how does that help me? How can I figure out how I can turn my career around after being under these conditions? And that's when my plan started. I ended up getting my own trainer outside of just working out with the team. I ended up finding my own nutritionist, finding my own chiropractor, my own massage therapist. I figured out how to create my own kind of ecosystem outside of what the team was providing, so I could focus more on what I was trying to do as an individual within the world of the team. And by the time I ended up getting to Chicago, when I signed with him as a free agent, um, I had created the infrastructure that was necessary. Uh, I had assessed all the things that I had done incorrectly, and I corrected them, and then I was on the right track. And then that's how my career ended up kind of taking off at that point. TJ, I have to be honest, I could just listen to you all day. I don't even have to ask you any questions. just tell your story. TJ, what did it mean to join the elite ten thousand yard rushing club? And how has your perspective on that career milestone changed since you retired? I didn't even know that was a milestone at first. You know, when I came to the NFL, I literally was like, hey, I made it to the NFL. That was my goal. And besides obviously winning the Super Bowl and being an all star player, they were just a lot of things that I was very ignorant of in regards to just the NFL and, uh, and milestones and things of that nature. You know, it's such a big, big world, and the odds of you accomplishing all those things are very small within that space. The odds of you even playing longer than two or three years are like this, you know, so some of those lofty goals, you know, you're not even really thinking about, you're just trying to make the team and make the right reads and block the right guy and catch the ball and, uh, know the adjustments and all the day to day stuff and prove yourself to your teammates, prove yourself to your fans. You know, there's so many different steps that you have to kind of take before you can even get to, like Pro Bowl and All-Pro and all those milestones.
So by the time I had kind of got in this rhythm as a running back, and I just kind of had my head down with blinders on, uh, every season, just my goal was one thousand yards every season. Next thing I know, I look up and they're handing me a ball after the Rams game in my eleventh year and they said, hey, you just went over ten thousand yards. I had no idea that I was even that close. I had even I didn't even have any idea that that was a milestone. So when they told me and, you know, they gave me the ball, it didn't hit me until after the game. Um, when I started getting phone calls from my old teammates like Brian Urlacher and some of these guys, and they would call me and say, hey, man, that's a great accomplishment. And I'm like, it is like I had just, you know, had to reset my whole entire agenda. As in, the NFL is just being a thousand yard rusher every season and competing that I didn't even realize that I had come up on that milestone. So I think that, for me, was the best way for me to, uh, to enter the ten thousand dollars club is I didn't even realize I was in it, a testament to just hard work. Keep your head down and, you know, you're you're collecting the yards. And before you know it, there you are. There, there. Yes, the work is the work. And it's the work ethic that I inherited from my family and from the community that I grew up in. And I think at the end of the day, success comes with simplicity. You know, we make things harder than they need to be most of the time. Uh, I always say, and my coaches always told me little details equal big results. And that's kind of how I approach everything in my life, whether it's business or whether it's just any obstacles that I'm overcoming. It's it's focusing on the simple, uh, elements of it and mastering those simple elements. And next thing you know, the obstacle is not in. It's not in your way anymore. And that was what happened with football, with, uh, the ten thousand yard club. Because honestly, I did not know that that was a milestone. I did not know that I was that close. I just had my head down until I ran into the wall. They're like, hey, there's a wall right there. And I looked up and I was like, oh, okay, I made it. So another major event in your career playing in a Super Bowl. Very few players get to do that at all. What is that like? How different is the game than every other game you've played in? Um, just that experience alone. It's the biggest event in the world. Yeah, that's a great question. I mean, it's a bittersweet for me because we ever win and and it's ah, you know, I've actually had dreams that I was playing in the Super Bowl and, um, I was warming up and getting ready in the locker room, and I was out for warm ups and, and as soon as I'm getting ready to run out on the field for the first play, Day I wake up. Something happens to wake me up.
And it feels so real that it kind of hurts because I'm like, oh, if I just had one more chance. But the experience overall, I mean, it's it's a, it's it's a dream for every football player. You know, it's such a hard thing to accomplish to win a Super Bowl, to even play in a Super Bowl. And when you actually realize that you're the biggest moment is when you win the champion NFC or AFC Championship game, and then you're like, wait a minute, I'm watching the Super Bowl. There's no one else left. You know all the teams are gone. I think that was the biggest surprise is, is when I ran out of the tunnel for the Super Bowl, there were only two teams like the bears logo was in the end zone, one end zone, and the Colts logo was in the other end zone. And it reminded me of the video game that I used to play on Nintendo Tecmo Bowl, where you know every game, each end zone was the team's logo. Um, Wherein in a typical game, there's a home. It's a home and away team. So, you know, we're playing in Chicago. It's bears everywhere. If we're playing at Indy, it's Colts everywhere. So, you know, there were little kind of nuanced things that I just realized. I looked in the middle of the field and they had the NFL logo. And typically it would be like the home team's logo, things like that. I was just like taking it all in, the cameras flashing constantly. The fact that this one game could determine your legacy one way or the other, um, high stakes and also how fast the game became, uh, because, you know, there's there's levels to each game in the NFL, preseason games are a little bit slower paced, uh, because most of the time, if you're a starter, you're just trying to get through training camp and not be injured. How can I get to Opening Day as healthy as possible? Because you're never going to be one hundred percent, but how can I be as healthy as possible? So the speed of the game is a little different because guys are, you know, they're playing hard, but they're not doesn't count. There's no incentive. I'm not going to get paid an incentive because I had two touchdowns in a preseason game and just, you know, but then when you get to opening Day, the speed changes, the intensity goes up. Because now all the stats matter, all the stats counts, all count, all the wins count. Um, and then the next point in the season where the speed picks up is right around week twelve or thirteen, when some of these guys, these teams are fighting for these divisional spots. And so you have to win. Otherwise you're out. You know, um, or a team loses and you win or there's so many different scenarios, but the speed picks up because guys are always a lot more focused and intense because they know the stakes are higher by the time they get to the playoffs. The game is picked up even that much more, and each game goes faster and faster. I'm saying all that to say when we played in the Super Bowl, I still don't remember much about the game. gang. It was so. It was cool. I ran out for for the for the warm ups. They introduced the bears. We ran out of the tunnel and it was a blur.
And then I look up and they're pulling out the ropes and the confetti coming down. And it's not for the bears. That experience was like a two week whirlwind from the time we won the NFC Championship game against the Saints until the game was over, so much so that I don't even really remember. So fast. I remember obviously how I felt, but it went by really, really fast. But it was the best experience that I've ever had as a football player, hands down. And after that dream you shared, I had the same dream that you were running out of this for the Super Bowl, where I agree on what? We'll get to that in a minute. You go from the bears to the Jets, and I kind of want to tie in two things here. Uh, you played in some smaller markets, Arizona, uh, being one of them. You played in two major markets in Chicago and New York from the business side, and you said you're an employee of a multi-billion dollar business than you were, but you're also a business owner of your personal brand. And, you know, you got to be a free agent in a pre-social media age more than marketing opportunities like off the field business opportunities like in each market. How did it differ and how do you take advantage of those? I mean, Chicago is a bears town. Um, in the Chicago Bears, fans grew up wanting to be bears players just because of the nostalgia. I mean, Chicago's it's one of the original teams in the NFL. So, I mean, the history there is I mean, it's unmatched the way that the the fans and the people of Chicago received the bears players is like, we're all family. We're connected. You know, we're connected. Whether we win, we're connected, whether we lose. Uh, the bears are like the glue to this city when it comes to, you know, connecting cultures, connecting conversations, uh, connecting interests. Um, so there were a lot of business opportunities in Chicago, man. There's so many successful business professionals there that, you know, literally snap a finger and you have access to whoever you want to talk to, whether it's owning a franchise, right, of a restaurant or, uh, you know, whether you want to get into, you know, real estate. I mean, the relationships are just there. Um, especially if you're playing well because everyone likes to connect the dots. You know, when things are going good. And that's just in life, period. New York was a little bit different. My first year in New York, we were four and twelve, which was actually probably the second roughest year. I just came from rushing for one thousand yards two seasons in a row and playing in the Super Bowl to getting traded to New York, and Chad Pennington went down, uh, in zero seven. We had a very, very young team. Young line. I think I had like one touchdown rushing, one touchdown receiving. And I had agreed to do this radio show with Boomer Esiason, and I forgot the other guy's name, and I had agreed to do it before the season, so I had been paid business opportunity. I had agreed to do this. They paid me up front.
Every week was brutal and we started off like one in four. I mean, and it was just brutal. And every week I was just getting destroyed. I was getting destroyed on TV and now he's from Long Island. He was on the Jets when they were terrible. He felt bad. Well, I mean, it just comes with the New York territory, you know, and and I, like you said, I played to small markets, you know, Arizona and Tampa. Well, yeah. You're going to get criticized, but they're not gonna run you out of the city. You know, Chicago my first year were five and eleven. They're not going to run you out of the city. They're just kind of almost like they're disappointed in you. Like like they're disappointed in like, their cousin or something. You know, it's like, you know, my cousin did something and I'm not talking to him right now, but I still love him. New York is like, hey, I love you this week. I hate you this week. So that was something that I had to get used to. I had to understand, like, hey, I have to backtrack back to the basics again, where I've had so much success in Chicago all the way to the Super Bowl. Now I'm starting over. And so I had to work through just the criticism on all of the markets and marketplaces in New York, man. I mean, from, uh, Manhattan all the way up to fans that are in upstate New York. I mean, it was it was tough, you know. I mean, even the home games, you know, some fans were like, you know, send Jones back to Chicago. He's got one touchdown, you know. Uh, I mean, it was it was a brutal year. And I ended up having about three hundred and thirty six carries. I think I was like in the top five in, uh, in attempts that year. And, and I still ended up with over eleven hundred yards, but I got my ass kicked, man. I mean, we had a tough year that year. We played the AFC North. You know, we played Baltimore, we played Pittsburgh, we played Cincinnati, we played Cleveland. That's a pretty tough physical conference As a running back, and I averaged about twenty five yards, twenty five carries a game. Um, so that was a tough year for me. Um, so business wasn't booming for me in oh seven. Uh, but oh, eight things changed. You know, Brett Favre came in, they brought in Damien Woody, they brought in Alan Faneca, they brought in Tony Richardson.
Um, you know, they gave me some guys, you know, that that were experienced and that could, you know, teach the younger guys like, uh, you know, Ferguson and Nick Mangold. And I had already established a relationship with them through our four and twelve season. You know, I had already established a great relationship with them, although we were figuring it out. Um, and so that season was a breakout season, you know, thirteen hundred yards, fifteen touchdowns. I was a starter in the Pro Bowl, first team all pro. So business was booming. You know, I had a lot of opportunities, you know, to to to connect the dots on the business end. I actually had a music label at that time as well. And um, I had a few artists that I was working with and producing music with. And so I ended up signing a deal with universal SQ. And Steve Rifkin, who's an icon in the music game. Part of that was because of, you know, the Jets and the success. So different worlds, but similar opportunities when you're winning, I would say Chicago and New York. So just to touch on it for a moment, your your other careers and and the pivots throughout your career, uh, going from a player to an actor, uh, can you walk us through how you did that being, you know, an NFL running back to pursuing an acting career, the mindset shift, and you know, how you approach this entirely new challenge? I mean, it was something I did not see happening. I was not thinking acting honestly when I retired, I didn't know what I don't know what I was thinking.
You know, I um, my twelfth year, uh, I was in Kansas City and, and I woke up one day on my day off, it was like a Tuesday. Um, and this was in the off season. And so I didn't have to go work out that day at the facility for the off season program. And I woke up and for some weird reason, I just was like, man, I don't know if I want to play football anymore. This is year twelve, and it was so random. And I remember I called my sister and I was like, hey, you know, I just had this weird feeling of like, this might be my last season. And she was like, well, what do you mean? Why do you feel like that? I was like, ah, I don't know. I just feel like this is it for me. I don't know if I still have the same fire that I had when I was seven years old. And going into that year, that feeling became more and more intense. And by the time I ended up in training camp, I was like, yeah, this is it. This is year twelve and this is my last season. So as I was playing through that season, I was trying to figure out what I want to do, but I had no idea because football was the one thing that motivated me, that I loved. And I was never really a guy that saw myself as just a football player. Right. You know, I went to University of Virginia. I graduated in three years. Um, I wanted, you know, I did all of the things that the typical football player doesn't do. Um, so I never wanted to see myself as just a one dimensional football player, but I didn't have anything else that I actually was passionate about. And I loved that, uh, was similar to football. So when I once the season was over in twenty eleven, um, when I retired, it was kind of like I was in this tornado. And then the I was thrown out and I just kind of landed in the middle of this field, and there was no one else around me. It was like this crazy feeling of like, isolation. And it's like, man, what am I supposed to do? My whole life has been regimented. I know every fall I'm playing football. I know every Friday night or Saturday night, I'm going to be in a hotel before the game. I have curfew, I have readings at thirty seven. I have walked through. It starts at noon. I mean, there was the schedule that had been my life for, you know what, twenty years, um, between high school and and the NFL and college, you know, I mean, and so how do you now be just you and not tied to a league, tied to a team, tied to a certain culture? How do you just kind of maintain and live within this world outside of the NFL shield? And that was very, very difficult for me. Um, it took me a while to just adjust to having my whole day where I'm like, what do I do? Where am I supposed to go? And the Giants actually wanted to sign me, um, for my thirteenth year. My agent, Drew Rosenhaus, said, hey, what are you. The Giants are looking for a back, uh, veteran back, you know, what do you think? And I was like, if I go back, I'm gonna to either embarrass myself because my heart's not in it, or I'm going to get hurt. That's what happens. And I declined. And so I was kind of drawing this individual journey for about a year after I retired, just trying to find level ground, you know, just trying to kind of plant my feet in something besides just going to the gym and just being by myself most of the day. And then I was introduced to acting, luckily, by one of my friends, and they were like, hey, you have a music label, let's add a film division to it. It was a pretty cool project that you could maybe produce as a producer, and you could take a role in it, and that would give you something to do, because at thirty three, you're retired. It's like, how do I work around like the retirement mindset? But actually still being thirty three, I still have so much left to do. And so I tried it and then it was cool. It was cool. I felt like it was a natural kind of thing for me because as a football player, you see me like this now in the interview. But then when I'm on the field, I'm number twenty. I'm, I'm an actor, You know, my antics are different. My energy is different. The stakes are higher. I'm a performer.
And so I assessed kind of just what my role was. And I was introduced to an incredible actor, legendary actor named Clifton Powell, uh, who's been in multiple legendary projects. And, uh, he told me he thought I had natural talent and he said I should pursue it full time. And so, um, I took him up on it, and, uh, I ended up getting an agent in New York, and they started sending me on auditions. And then I booked a really, really big role on a TV series. Um, and so I was like, hey, you know, let me give this a try, move to LA, and just got lost in it. And it helped me evolve from being a football player to being a regular person that is ambitious and just chasing my dream versus being this kind of like football player who's living in this like very aggressive, chaotic, violent, Egotistical world and and then I was able to find similarities in acting that were help when it helped me transition from football to acting, which is like your script. The more you know the script, the more you know your character, the easier it is to just react as an actor and hear the words and be motivated and moved by the words from the other actor, and then you respond from a real place football. The more you know your plays, the more you know the playbook, the coverages, the fronts, the blitzes, the signals, everything. The more you know, you just play, you react. A play is designed to go inside. If you don't know the blocking scheme, you're lost because you had this much time to make a decision and you tackled or strip fumble or whatever. But when you know the playbook, you know the scheme. Oh, I know this guy is going to get up to the linebacker. Oh, I see he's not going to be able to get there because the linebackers on the inside, I'm going to bounce it outside before the play even starts. Those are some of the similarities that I saw.
I think you hit on a few really important things that are throughlines to almost every conversation we have with with former athletes, current athletes or business owners. I retire at like thirty something, which is a crazy age for anybody to be retired from their profession because it's typically like the early stages of your professional career, right? So all of a sudden, your personal life is very much in an early stage. Your professional life is at the end. You know, God willing, seventy plus years of life to live. On top of that, you have seventy plus years of like, life to live with money and the chunk of your typical high income earning stage is behind you now. So like that's an added stressor that a lot of athletes come into. Like and same thing with business owners. You might have worked in a business for twenty, thirty years. You put your blood, sweat and tears into you sell it. And even if you get a chunk of money, all of a sudden the paycheck stops. And that's a different kind of way of living on a day to day. And how do I direct all the passion I've been living with and singular focus? Like, who am I? Like what? What is the thing that I love to do aside from my career, right? And that's something that we've found a lot of cases and also to I think a lot of people have a hard time separating the money that professional athletes make with retirement. Right. Because the money that we're paid is just it's merely based off of what the business generates. Right. So billion dollar industry where the product, you know, we make millions because it's a billion dollar industry. No different. I started to see myself no different than a Coke can or, um, you know, uh, bottle of body wash, like we're products. I'm. I'm a product. I'm no different than any other product that's being sold. I'm just one of those products. And it seems like a simple thing. You know, there's so much money. Someone guaranteed thirty million or fifty million or sixty million. It's very easy to not be able to separate a guy doing what he loves and is making that much money from him. Being an actual human that just has a similar experience to anyone else that might not make that money because they don't do that job. And that's what I realized too, after being retired for thirteen years, is I'm able to sit back and literally watch the game and hear perspectives and understand perspectives that as a player, I wouldn't even give a chance because our world is so unique that any outside noise potentially could change the trajectory of how you think and how you you train yourself to be able to be productive. Because in the NFL, from the time you get drafted, it's pressure. And that's your legacy. Because no matter how much money you made as a player, your legacy is how you play. That's all I kept thinking in Arizona was, I'm a bust, I'm a first round bust, and everybody's saying it. And it didn't stop even after I left Arizona and even like the first couple years in Chicago, you know, I'd have a one hundred and fifty yard game and, you know, you'd watch it back on TV. And it was a bust in Arizona. It's like, you know, I just had one hundred and fifty yards two weeks in a row.
But that's your legacy. And and and people don't understand the, the mental and psychological effects that has on you when you're used to being the guy your whole career and all of a sudden you're not the guy anymore. Not only are you not the guy, but you suck. And if you're in a city like New York, it's high stakes. Uh, high reward if you're great. They see you and they love you. If you. If you suck, they see you in New York. They tell you you suck. Um, and they don't care if your your family's with you. Your kids are with you. Um, but that's what you sign up for, you know, you sign up for that. So I completely understand the retirement dynamic and that conversation and that kind of, uh, Experience. Now that I'm thirteen years removed, I have a lot more empathy for anyone that retires, regardless of whether you play in the NFL, because it's always about finding the next thing, regardless of whether you're thirty three or whether you're seventy three. Growing up, what was your relationship with money like? And then, you know, how did that relationship sort of shift, um, and grow and, you know, like you said, you know, a player can can have a million dollar contract, right? Doesn't mean they're taking home a million bucks. Right. Who's talking to you about taxes? Who's talking to you about spending too much? Then you've got family members. You've got friends. You know, you feel like I want to, you know, help everyone. Um, you know, how do you manage all that? And, you know, what was that like? That's that's a great question because that's that's probably the hardest part. The hardest part is all of the pressure that you immediately are responsible. Well, all the the obligations that you're responsible for that you weren't responsible for, for setting up people around.
You don't understand money. And so they don't even realize what they're asking of you or how it's going to affect you. They don't even understand money. So if they don't understand money and you don't understand money, then money's going to go. And people in general, whether you're an NFL player, most people don't understand money unless you either come from money, a family that understands money or people that are financially literate. You know you're living day to day. You're living check to check. You're, um, you're not. You can't save money because more than likely you're not making enough to save necessarily. You can save money, but you still have to pay your bills. You still have to eat. You still. I mean, there's expenses. I didn't grow up in an environment where financial literacy was kind of at the forefront because just the community that I came from is not based around money. There's there's not a huge economic structure there. It's coal mining and it's strictly blue collar work. And people are happy that way. They're happy making their check, you know, every couple of weeks and buying milk and eggs and, you know, and saving a little money for Christmas and, um, simple life. Um, so, so financial literacy wasn't really a big topic in my environment and in my household. So when I was drafted, um, when you're used to having a kind of check to check mindset, it doesn't matter how much money you have. It's the, uh, the condition. It's the the routine. If I make if I have ten dollars and I'm used to spending eight of those dollars immediately, and if you have a hundred, a million dollars, you're probably going to spend eight hundred thousand immediately. It's the mindset. It's not how much money you have, and that's how a lot of people end up in financial trouble. And people are like, how did that happen? How do you have all this money? It's not the money, it's the mindset.
Um, and, you know, unfortunately, there are people who just become people that see you as money and not as a person. That's how that happened to me with a lot of people in my life. And it ruined relationships. Uh, it ruined, um, you know, trust in a lot came with that because these people, they're not seeing you as an employee. They don't see football as a job for you. They just see you as playing football like you always have. Now you're making money. And they also maybe feel they may be owed something for their participation in helping you get there. And, um, and then, you know, if you're a competitive person and you take on obligations and you don't want to let anyone down, um, and there's multiple people that come at you, not only people you know, but people you don't know. I have this opportunity, I have this opportunity, I have this opportunity. If you don't have anyone that's smart enough or experienced enough to say, hey, you shouldn't do this or that, then you're a, you know, like a wounded, wounded animal. A lot of pitfalls come with having money. You know, I experienced some situations where I had to, you know, just cut a lot of people and relationships back. And, um, I was fortunate enough to find an incredible financial firm, um, that I was able to work with and connect the dots with. And I never understood how a dollar made a dollar. Um, I just understood how my work helped me make a dollar. Those are two totally different scenarios. If you don't know how to work your money, uh, you're going to lose it and or you're going to win. On the flip side, you're going to work yourself, you know, to the bone. And and you're not going to make as much money. So that's, you know, that's a huge Problem with just within society. Obviously there's a highlight on professional athletes because we get so much money so fast, and those are the stories that you hear most of the time this guy went broke or this guy went broke, you know, because part of that is entertainment, too. We're entertainers through and through, regardless of whether it's on the field, off the field gossip, drama, he went broke. He did this, he did that. He, um, whatever we do, we're entertainers. We're a product. So our entire life now, intimate moments and all become a part of the public's entertainment, good or bad. And I feel I feel sorry for a lot of guys because I totally understand how they can end up in those situations. Um, the financial literacy is kind of like they should be at the forefront of every family, even if you don't have money, you know, that's. But a lot of times you're too busy paying the bills to even be thinking about, how can I save money? Or how can this money make me money? because you need that money to to eat.
That's a huge conversation. That's a big, big conversation that definitely needs to be had for sure. It's it can be such a sensitive topic. You know, it's I'm so glad you brought it up that way. We we do a lot of financial literacy, especially for young athletes. It's a major focus of ours. Young people generally. But, um, we were just at Villanova, my alma mater. So a lot of heartstrings there. Speaking to the men's and women's basketball program because it's happening to kids even younger now with nil. You touched on earlier and there are eighteen, nineteen years old. They're not making millions of dollars. In most cases, it's tens of maybe hundreds of thousands at the high end. And they have the same pressures of people coming, asking them for things and not, you know, maybe just seeing them as ATM or not really understanding, you know, how all this works in the grand scheme of things. And they're feeling the pressure of how do I say no to these people have been with me my whole life. And it's, you know, you're twenty five. It's tough, but if you're eighteen, it's even harder. So, um, I think finding the right group of people around you professionally and because family can be the hardest ones to say no to. Yeah, it's an important thing. They are the hardest people to say no to because they have the most access to your to your emotions and, and, uh, you can't care for them most of the time. The most. And, uh, all they know is what they need right now. What they what they need right now is more important than what you may need later. And, um, and a lot of times, you know, we fall for that, you know, and, uh, yeah, I mean, the, the initial situation, I mean, you know, there's I can only imagine some of the tax problems that some of these eighteen, nineteen, twenty year olds are starting to have. And, I mean, I'm all for that idea, but I do think that if there's no regulation or some sort of structure put in place, a lot of these kids are going to end up in financial trouble before they even even graduate. That's part of it. It's like just because you have an Nil deal doesn't mean you're going to the NFL. Yeah.
How many great players did you go against in training camp that were studs at Alabama, USC that like, I don't know, working in a cubicle now, right. I mean, it's yeah. Yeah, yeah. Because the motivation for me was to make the money in the NFL. Sure. And then I found motivation to be an all star player. Once I was in the NFL, I was in the incubator. I was in the, uh, the system. But, you know, if I made two million dollars as a junior, I don't know how motivated I would be to be the first pick in the NFL if. And that's why it's a very complex conversation. It's there's there's literally no right or wrong. It's it's subjective. But the people who suffer the most are the kids because, you know, eighteen years old, your parents are asking you for money and you don't want to give it to them. And now all of a sudden, there's a rift in your family. And now emotionally, you're struggling and you're trying to play football. You're trying to get a degree, you're trying to go to class. You can't focus. Your mother is upset with you. Your father's upset. I mean, there's so I can only imagine how many problems are happening right now within that in our initial world between families and siblings. And, um, you know, I guess what biggie said mo money, mo problems. I think maybe the play that you're most well remembered for was the the fourth and one or fourth and two in San Diego when everyone in the world knew what was coming and you guys just ran it down their throats anyway. I mean, that was amazing. Yeah. I mean, you know, Rex, arguably the greatest coach I've ever played for ever in my life, um, after my second year in New York. Uh, you know, they had structured my deal where they backloaded it and they gave me money up front. But my third year, I was supposed to make the least amount of money on my deal. And I'm coming off for two seasons with a thousand yards. You know, I'm just coming off a Pro Bowl season. And I wanted them to take my fourth year salary and my third year salary and just break it up and make it even. And my mom was like, no, I'm not going for it. So I didn't come to the offseason program. I did this whole I'm not coming thing, which is a tactic. Obviously, I want to be there, but, you know, it's it's negotiation number one. And um, and Rex was there too. And he was new and I never met him.
And, uh, I didn't know how I was going to feel when I actually went back and agreed to come back for minicamp. First day I met Rex. We just talked and he was like, listen, man, you know we need you here. We're trying to do something great here. I think we got a team that can win the Super Bowl. You know, you're a huge part of this. And you know, obviously you have the business. And I never tried to tell you how to do your business. But I do know we have something special. If we can win here in New York, man, you know, your legacy will be cemented in history. And I appreciated that. I appreciated that conversation and I didn't have any more conversations about my contract. I said, hey, you know what? Let's just play this year out. Let the chips fall where they may. That guy could get you to run through a brick wall because he would stand up for you. He. He talked to us as though we were his brothers. He didn't. It wasn't like a it was a coach. But it was also like a big brother. Right? It was a big brother. And, um, and I think that's why he had so much respect. And he's getting so much respect. You know, obviously his father was a legendary coach And you know, his twin brother is a great coach, but he was a defensive coach for a running back. He was my favorite coach because he was a defensive guy. He wanted to run the ball. He wanted to play tough defense. You know, he I knew he depended on me because that year was very tough. You know, Mark came in as a rookie. Sanchez. And in New York City as a rookie quarterback. Man, that is not a job to play with because in other cities, smaller markets, you know, say like a Trevor Lawrence, right. He's in Jacksonville. It's a smaller market, right. He has more room to develop, grow, maybe have a couple of mistakes or you know season here. Not so good season there. Not so good New York. No no you don't have a practice to to develop. You don't have a game to develop. It's New York and in Mark I think he did well his first few games. But once they caught on to what he did well and they started to scheme for him, things got a little tough. And I ended up ended up with, I think I was second in the NFL in rushing attempts that year. Uh, thirty one um, and I ended up with over fourteen hundred yards and fourteen touchdowns. And that was a tough year. Leon Washington broke his leg, so he was out for, you know, I guess five games or six games or something like that, maybe. And everyone knew we were running the ball every game. Didn't matter who we were playing. You knew it was coming because he told you. He told him. He said we're going to run A, B, C, and D, you have to stop it. And that meant stop me, which I was all for at that point in my career. I'm like, give me the ball, give it, give me the ball every play. And so Rex and I had a really great relationship and, and um, it was it was sad at the end of that um, that season when we lost in, in, uh, in Indianapolis because I knew more than likely I wouldn't be back because I was just making too much money for them to keep me. And if they wanted me to be back, they would have renegotiated my contract and they didn't do it.
And so I knew in Indianapolis, coming out of the locker room, I was like, wow, this is my last game as a jet. And, uh, and I talked to Rex and we had a great conversation. And he's an emotional guy, man. He's a he's a he's a passionate guy. You know, you see him on TV. And I know a lot of times fans give him a hard time, you know, because of his passion and some of the things he says. But that's why we loved him because he was real. And he just said what you were thinking, and he wasn't afraid to take on the, the, the, the brunt of whatever pressure and, uh, criticism came with what he said because we were all feeling what he said. He just said it. And I always respect people that will say what everyone else is thinking. Uh, if I saw Rex right now, you know, it'd probably be an emotional moment, man, because, you know, we just had so many real moments together in that one season, um, that I played for him, that it it it resonates, you know, really, really like, uh, you know, Rex and I really think he should be coaching in the NFL somewhere. He's an incredible coach, man. Great coach TJ. I've got one more question for you, and then we'll, uh, we'll either wrap or we'll see if we're missing anything. But one question we like to ask, um, our guests on our podcast is what does sweat equity mean to you? I like that. I like that. Uh, sweat equity to me is, uh, it's the the the fertilizer, um, to the success of the company. So for me, you know, all I've known is sweat equity in everything that I've done, you know, literally in sports, uh, as an actor, you know, I enrolled in four different actors studios when I moved to LA. So I didn't just go out there and just start acting in projects. No, I mean, the people that I was auditioning against. They studied at Juilliard. They were drama majors in college. You know, while I was playing, you know, twelve years in the NFL and four years of college, sixteen years of my life, I was playing football. They were training for auditions and, uh, working on plays and writing and going to film school and all the different things. And so I didn't think that I was going to go out there and just book something. And also too, I didn't want to just book football roles. I didn't want to book sports roles. I didn't want to book things that just made me be a football player who's trying to act like I really wanted people to respect me as an actor. So I went the long route. I had my place in Florida, my house, but I, I ended up renting a small one bedroom apartment in the middle of Hollywood with a community washer and dryer in the basement, because I felt like I needed to experience what real actors experienced to understand their grind and their journey. I added the middle initial to my name Thomas Q Jones. To separate myself from Thomas Jones, the football player, because these are two different people. Um, Thomas Q Jones is an actor. He's a producer. Thomas Jones is number twenty, the football player. The Jets and the bears. So psychologically, I needed to separate myself and reinvent myself from me, take myself seriously as an actor. And so me living in that apartment, no one knew who I was in the apartment, by the way, there were a lot of, like, senior citizens in this apartment. So, uh, you know, they didn't know who I was.
They just thought I was kind of this buff guy that just worked out and just moved in there. Um, but it was it was cool because I was able to kind of maneuver just kind of stealth and really study what an artist and an aspiring actors journey is. And as I was enrolling in these classes and doing these scenes with these actors, a lot of them didn't know who I was, which I loved, and some of them did. But I earned their respect through the sweat equity. Going to class twice a week, uh, six hours a week, Thursdays from seven to ten for audition technique class, and then Sundays at a different studio for scene study from seven to ten. For four years in multiple studios, putting my own money into a feature film that I produced, that I was a part of the writing and that I starred in because I wanted to give myself an opportunity to see if I could really be a leading man in my own project, and not just typecast as, like, this kind of buff guy that can play like the heavy or the love interest, but like a really layered, complex character. And so sweat equity to me is everything. It's it's how you earn the right to be successful. It's how you earn the right to attain your goals. Um, I think all of that comes from the world of football, because football, nothing about it is easy. If you rush for one thousand yards, you don't just do that. You've put work in in the off season weight room, film study, running, uh, all of the things. Massage, all the necessary sweat equity you you you did in the summer pays off during the season. And so that mindset and that approach to me is uh, is very important in any venture, whether it's sports related, whether it's acting, whether it's business. Uh, that's what I take into every venture that I get into. You know, I understand I'm looking for the sweat equity. And if people haven't, if they don't understand sweat equity, for the most part, I kind of have a hard time relating to them and working for them because I need to know with, with, with sweat equity. I know that you're in it for the long haul. You're willing to do the work to see it, see it all the way through to the end. So sweat equity I that's why I love this question, because a lot of people don't understand the importance of sweat equity. It's very important. I totally agree with you TJ. Thank you so much for joining us today. Again. It was an absolute pleasure getting to know more about you and listen to the stories of your incredible career the pivots, the shifts, the mindset. We are so grateful for your time today, and we are excited to see everything that you accomplish. We wish you all the best and we look forward to seeing you soon. Thank you so much. This was great. The conversation, the, uh, the energy I love just, you know, um, how this this platform is, is, is set up and you all make it very easy to, to have an honest, genuine conversation and be vulnerable and open. And so I appreciate you all and I give and I appreciate your giving me this opportunity. This podcast is presented for informational purposes only, and should not be relied upon as investment advice or the basis for making any investment decisions. It does not constitute an offer to sell or a solicitation of an offer to buy any specific product or service. UBS does not provide legal or tax advice, and we would recommend listeners to obtain appropriate, independent Professional advice. Some of the views and opinions expressed may not be those of UBS Group AG or its affiliates. UBS Financial Services, Inc. offers investment advisory services in its capacity as an SEC registered investment advisor and brokerage services in its capacity as an SEC registered broker dealer. These services are separate and distinct, differ in material ways, and are governed by different laws and separate arrangements. It is important that you understand the ways in which we conduct business, and that you carefully read the agreements and disclosures that we provide about the products or services we offer. For more information, please review client relationship summary provided at UBS. Summary UBS Financial Services, Inc. is a subsidiary of UBS Group AG and is a member of Finra and SIPC.